Midou Ban (Getbackers) runs the One Punch Man gauntlet

[Nik Hasta]

Midou Ban, the demon child of witch clan, takes the fight to the characters from One Punch Man.

Ban is the end of series version. He gets fully healed between each battle but his Jagan hypnotism technique doesn't get refreshed. As is canon, he only has three uses of it and trying a fourth will kill him instantly.

Location is a deserted Tokyo. Ban fights in the following order:

1) Speed of Sound Sonic
2) Sea King
3) Demon Cyborg Genos
4) Void Fist Suiryu
5) Silver Fang Bang (Bang can call in Bomb as backup if required)
6) Super Alloy Dark Shine
7) Melzegaard
8) Flashy Flash
9) Atomic Samurai
10) Garou (Current version in Murata version)
11) Golden Sperm
12) Saitama

How far does Ban get? Will three uses of the Jagan only and his good two fists see him through?

Bonus Scenarios:

I) Kuroudu Akabane runs the same gauntlet, end of series version.
II) Ban and Ginji run the gauntlet together, Ginji has access to his powers in the Lightning Emperor form.

[Nik Hasta]

Figured this would be a bit of a deep cut. I've been reviewing Getbackers as a series and will take this opportunity to update my speed breakdown from the Speed Algorithms thread. Multiple posts incoming.

[Nik Hasta]

So to open my posting, here's a speed breakdown for Getbackers focusing primarily on Ban Midou that I made a little while back.

Things To Note:

- Getbackers has a big and complicated speed algorithm, it's right up there with Hokuto no Ken and Dragonball in terms of people just apparently randomly jumping speed by insane degrees, so the cast - Ban included - are all really quick. Definitely massively multimach by the end, potentially in the hundreds of mach, but I don't have the number crunching for that.
- A lot of Getbackers takes place inside Mugenjou (Infinity Fortress) a place that is part virtual reality, part real life, part quantum computing, part magic and reality gets really weird in there. This means a bunch feats have certain contextual elements to them. Getbackers likes to throw around ideas like they are going out of style and some things may come with longwinded explanations. Furthermore, Getbackers likes to reference real world science for some stuff (notably black holes, the speed of light and so forth) but if you actually follow through with the science then things stop making any kind of sense, so we need to look at the stuff that actually happens, not the "science" explanations. I'm looking at you Masaki.
- In a manner not too dissimilar to Jojo's Bizarre Adventure, a lot of people's powers have rules and gimicks that make them tricky to use/counter/analyse.

So, with that said, let's get into Ban.

By series end, Ban is arguably in the top five most powerful characters in the series and the primary yardstick for establishing the general speed curve as he has the most feats by quite some margin.

For starters, I'll bust out the absolute minimum in terms of speed for Ban. This is unamped, beginning of series, clearly dicking around Ban so this the minimum he can do.

Context: In the third arc of the manga, Ban and company return to Infinity Fortress and are confronted by Ayame the Spider who has zero G metal bones and hair. He is sitting on a girder some distance above Ban and cuts him on the cheek, Ban then decides to play with him.





Pretty self-explanatory, Ban nips up whomps Ayame in the chops and returns to the same spot without even appearing to move. That's the lowest level of effort him and it's pretty ridiculous and he gets way faster than that.

[Nik Hasta]

Significantly later on in the series; we encounter Ban being much more series and explicitly reaching his limits and going beyond to a higher gear.

When fighting Dokubachi of the Karuido Clan - who is a living colony of killer bees (don't ask) who can take on human form and has the kind of ridiculous stats were he treats the previously shown level for Ban as little more than a speedbump - Ban attacks, their attacks (visually apparently just one punch each) just seem to clash and then Ban falls over injured. Dokubachi then notes that Ban had attacked him 12 times in less than 0.1 of a second while simultaneously deflecting Dokubachi's own attacks in turn in a such a way that he didn't get poisoned.



As the fight progresses, Dokubachi proceeds to bop him something fierce and Ban summons the power of the Serpent to actively amp himself.



As noted in the scan, he's now launching 32 different attacks in "an instant", we can presume at least the same >0.1 of a second, and Dokubachi is beginning to be overwhelmed by his speed.

[Nik Hasta]

Right, going over to text based stuff because I've got a lot of ground to cover.

We're cutting to the final arc of the manga, the Get Back the Lost Time arc takes up just a shy of a third of the whole series, Ban and Ginji head to Beltline inside Infinity Fortress. Essentially, Infinity Fortress is divided into three sections - Lower Town, Beltline and Babylon City. The higher you go, the more crazy powerful the residents there become. Previously in the series, Ban and his allies have only been in Lower Town.

When Ban and Ginji arrive in Beltline and let's see how he did against someone who is literally described as a scrub by Beltline standards:



So that would be Ban getting blitzed and slammed through three solid stone walkways before he can even do anything. And Yuuri, the guy who did it, is literally a non-entity not only in terms of Beltline but also in terms of where Ban ends up. Yuuri proceeds to beat the tar out of Ban, even stopping him when he summons the power of the Serpent to amp himself. The point here is that people in Beltline treat the Ban we outlined above as literally nothing.

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Moving forward though, things a get a bit muddy and I'll be switching over to text based description because this a lot of ground to cover.

After getting beaten down by Yuuri, Ban and his partner are rescued by Paul who dashes into the area they are fighting in, snatches Ban and Ginji and carries them away so fast that Yuuri and his equally powerful sister perceive the lead duo as just disappearing into thin air.

Paul gives Ban and Ginji some Voodoo Coffee, which I'm not even going to get into just suffice to say it's an ambiguous power-up, and they go from having issues with scrubs, to being able to reasonably participate in battles that Paul - superspeed blitzes scrubs while carrying people away guy - finds challenging.

That's a huge jump right there.

Please note, Paul is still faster than the opponents (and Ban and Ginji) he is fighting but his age means he can't maintain peak speed for more than a few exchanges. Said exchanges involve him fighting three opponents simultaneously with apparently solidified afterimages. His primary opponent, Shimon Miroku is also noted to swing a hyperdense space metal sword faster than the speed of sound and is able to keep up with Paul even at his peak.

Later, Paul then reverses his personal flow of time to put himself into his younger body so he has the stamina to go with his massive speed and he completely rocks the socks of the previous opponents just by, from his perspective, walking past them. It's ludicrously cool and illustrative of how ridiculously quick he is.

During this time, while Paul is still noted as being faster than Ban, Ban can still just about follow his movements in combat.

Then, Paul and his old partner Der Kaiser, throw down and Ban and company cannot even perceive that they are fighting. They seem to be completely motionless and stuff is just exploding around them. This clearly highlights how fast Paul is in comparison to Ban.

So, skipping a bunch of stuff, in the endgame; Paul, absurdly multimach, massively beyond dudes who crap on all of the above Ban feats, a dude who rocks guys who are multiple tiers above said scrub dudes - that Paul Wan. In the final battle of the series, Ban versus Akabane, Paul can barely follow their moves at all and theorises that he's seeing only one out of every 300 of their respective attacks at each other.

Ban is losing but then digs deep and powers up to his highest level and unlocks the Angel Arm and is able to, not only fight evenly with Akabane, but overwhelm him and beat him in combat. He also starts throwing in semi-solid afterimage tricks into the fight as well.

That's like... ridiculously above multimach level.

So that's how fast End of Series Ban is.

[Sol_M]

OPM characters speed breakdown. I'm sure you want to do it. Please please please!


...

Ahem. Anyway, most of these seem to boil down to Ban being able to speedblitz and hurt them sufficiently:

1) Speed of Sound Sonic: Ban is way faster than even Four Shadows Burial and should be able to take this pretty handily.
2) Sea King: Again, vastly outsped, but is actually very tanky and has regen to boot. This is a really difficult fight because of it, but Ban should eventually win if he doesn't tire himself out.
3) Demon Cyborg Genos: High damage output but is not nearly fast enough or durable enough in any form.
4) Void Fist Suiryu: Again, Ban takes it based on speed alone, even if Suiryu is pretty strong and tough.
5) Silver Fang Bang (Bang can call in Bomb as backup if required): Again, the speed thing. I don't think Bang has any speed feats on this level.
6) Super Alloy Dark Shine: Speedblitz. Again.
7) Melzegaard: If Ban can figure out the trick to killing him, yeah. He's fast enough that he could do it, actually.
8) Flashy Flash: Finally someone who might be able to compete speedwise (if we take that one feat against Garou being done in milliseconds and not microseconds). Ban can Jagan him though.
9) Atomic Samurai: Again Jagan FTW.
10) Garou (Current version in Murata version): Ten count possibly? Again, he's way faster, so even if he can't kill Garou, he could do enough damage to keep him down for a bit. Worst case scenario, he has to Jagan for this.

I'm completely ignoring Saitama, because pfft. You're so funny, putting him on that list like he belongs there. Why don't you post the Saitama speed breakdown too while you're at it? :P

I guess he could hypnotize disable him for a ten count? Maybe? But that would require him to beat at least one of Flashy Flash, Atomic Samurai, and Golden Sperm without Jagan. I can actually buy him doing it for the first two, but not sure.

[Nik Hasta]

OPM characters speed breakdown. I'm sure you want to do it. Please please please!

I could maybe do it. How in-depth are we thinking?

Ahem. Anyway, most of these seem to boil down to Ban being able to speedblitz and hurt them sufficiently:

For me it's something less of a speed issue, my view is Ban could pretty reliably land hits on most of the people in here.

Heck, I'd be of the opinion that he could maybe put hands on Saitama if he really tried. Purely in terms of speed because mans is stupid fast.

The bigger question for me is offensive ability. I read through the Get Back the Lost Time Arc in its entirety yesterday and figuring out how hard the GB cast hit is actually very challenging. I honestly think their durability outstrips their offensive game in some respects.

1) Speed of Sound Sonic: Ban is way faster than even Four Shadows Burial and should be able to take this pretty handily.

No argument here. Sonic also lacks the offensive power to really hurt Ban in my opinion.

2) Sea King: Again, vastly outsped, but is actually very tanky and has regen to boot. This is a really difficult fight because of it, but Ban should eventually win if he doesn't tire himself out.

Likewise agreed.

3) Demon Cyborg Genos: High damage output but is not nearly fast enough or durable enough in any form.

Genos is surprisingly fragile for a superhuman cyborg.

4) Void Fist Suiryu: Again, Ban takes it based on speed alone, even if Suiryu is pretty strong and tough.

Suiryu is plenty quick though, I think Ban will notice him a bit more than say, Sonic. And he hits like a truck.

5) Silver Fang Bang (Bang can call in Bomb as backup if required): Again, the speed thing. I don't think Bang has any speed feats on this level.

His blitzing of the Ugmon and the other members of the Monster Council was pretty OD, I'm kind of hoping we'll see more of him doing good stuff when the redraw catches up to there. He is surprisingly durable though, Melzagaard didn't really hurt him all that much and he was casually blasting holes in buildings. Ban might have a bit of an issue here.

6) Super Alloy Dark Shine: Speedblitz. Again.

Dark Shine can literally ignore Puri Puri Prisoner going all out on him, like literally sit there and not even notice it. He also ate a ton of hits from quasi-awakened Garou and was even managing to kind of put hands on him. Ban might be in for a rough time on this one.

This one will require me digging out an offensive power breakdown for Ban.

7) Melzegaard: If Ban can figure out the trick to killing him, yeah. He's fast enough that he could do it, actually.

Agreed on this one.

8) Flashy Flash: Finally someone who might be able to compete speedwise (if we take that one feat against Garou being done in milliseconds and not microseconds). Ban can Jagan him though.

Agreed as well. Flashy Flash is a less scary Akabane when all's said and done and Ban did, kind of, beat him.

9) Atomic Samurai: Again Jagan FTW.

I feel like Atomic Samurai is the most slept on member of S Class. Guy is stupid fast. Jagan is very necessary here. In a straight fight, Ban might be in for an extremly rough time.

10) Garou (Current version in Murata version): Ten count possibly? Again, he's way faster, so even if he can't kill Garou, he could do enough damage to keep him down for a bit. Worst case scenario, he has to Jagan for this.

Agreed. Garou is a tough cookie.

I'm completely ignoring Saitama, because pfft. You're so funny, putting him on that list like he belongs there. Why don't you post the Saitama speed breakdown too while you're at it? :P

I did the babby one from a while back so your wish is my command. ^_^

Basic Saitama Speed Breakdown

As with every discussion involving Saitama, the usual caveat applies. Even as far as we are in the original manga, we have never seen Saitama even get close to going all out.

However, we can look at the speed algorithm of everyone else and work out what his absolute minimum has to be. This will contain minor spoilers for a fight or two.

So... I guess Genos is a useful enough measuring stick.

When he appears, Base Genos is capable of tearing the legs of a superspeed enemy in flight with such speed and precision that they don't even notice that their legs have gone until they see him holding their legs. He outruns his own incinerator blasts to their targets and generally pulls off your standard anime blink movement thing.

So, soft pitch at high endish bullet time, maybe?

Likely faster.

First time Genos, who is still in his base body, encounters Speed of Sound Sonic, Sonic blitzes around him with impunity and Genos is like; "Huh, he's pretty crazy fast,"

So, we're a solid tier up on high end bullet timerish right there.

Genos then gets his upgraded body and gets into another fight with Sonic later on. Sonic and him are fairly even now so Genos has reached the same level. Genos then "accelerates," and starts utterly overwhelming Sonic, deliberately snatching bits off his clothes, making him look like he's real slow. So that's another level up.

Sonic then activates his own superspeed technique, Four Shadows Burial, and he's at a level of speed that Genos can barely perceive so his only option is to try and counter with an AoE. So that's another level up, quite a steep one at that.

So, flash forward to the Garou arc, which is currently only in the original webcomic so this may change when Murata gets to this part, and we see Genos, enhanced body and all, fetch up against Gums and Black Sperm and they both tear him to pieces faster than he can react. Add another order of magnitude onto that and kiss Genos goodbye because he has ceased to be relevant. Bang then goes in on the same monsters and pretty much blitzes them with ease, which is another order of magnitude. Shortly after this, Black Sperm unifies all of his cells to become Golden Sperm and he's on a level where he's even effortlessly blitzing Tatsumaki, who was casually monstering on everyone at that point.

Garou then rocks up, blitzes /everyone/ including Golden Sperm and specifically notes that he's not really having to try that hard.

He then... finally, fetches up against Saitama and is still utterly outclassed by a non-serious Saitama.

So... to recap, that's... ten orders of magnitude above high end bullet timerish to get to Saitama and that's still Saitama when he's not trying.

He's certainly in the high multiples of mach. Somewhere in the hundreds or something.

This isn't fully complete but it's a good indicator of his speed.

I guess he could hypnotize disable him for a ten count? Maybe? But that would require him to beat at least one of Flashy Flash, Atomic Samurai, and Golden Sperm without Jagan. I can actually buy him doing it for the first two, but not sure.

I reckon he could beat Flashy Flash without pretty reliably. Guy is just Akabane with less options.

[Nik Hasta]

Also, hi Sol! Haven't seen you in a wee bit!

[Sol_M]

Hello! Yes, it's been a while. Hope you're doing well!

I could maybe do it. How in-depth are we thinking?

Just your general idea on what speed the mid-upper echleons tend to operate at and how they're tiered. I think most characters don't even have much in the way of direct speed feats, there are just a small handful of S class heroes/monsters/others that do. But the ones that do have speed feats are pretty impressive so it should be worth doing.

For me it's something less of a speed issue, my view is Ban could pretty reliably land hits on most of the people in here.

Heck, I'd be of the opinion that he could maybe put hands on Saitama if he really tried. Purely in terms of speed because mans is stupid fast.

The bigger question for me is offensive ability. I read through the Get Back the Lost Time Arc in its entirety yesterday and figuring out how hard the GB cast hit is actually very challenging. I honestly think their durability outstrips their offensive game in some respects.

I think Ban is pretty up there in the GB universe in terms of single target damage. He has all that punching through diamond, making great buildings tremble with his punches and and stuff, unless I'm misremembering. I think he should be able to hurt most people here.

Genos is surprisingly fragile for a superhuman cyborg.

It doesn't help that he ends up fighting the most difficult opponents past normal human limits, usually. Until Saitama shows up to save the day.

Suiryu is plenty quick though, I think Ban will notice him a bit more than say, Sonic. And he hits like a truck.

He's fast, but I think Ban probably has enough advantage in speed still that he would have a hard time doing much damage to him. And Ban's pretty evasive too, it's one of the things he consistently does. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Ban also have a ranged game?

His blitzing of the Ugmon and the other members of the Monster Council was pretty OD, I'm kind of hoping we'll see more of him doing good stuff when the redraw catches up to there. He is surprisingly durable though, Melzagaard didn't really hurt him all that much and he was casually blasting holes in buildings. Ban might have a bit of an issue here.

How fast would you peg him at at the moment?

Dark Shine can literally ignore Puri Puri Prisoner going all out on him, like literally sit there and not even notice it. He also ate a ton of hits from quasi-awakened Garou and was even managing to kind of put hands on him. Ban might be in for a rough time on this one.

This one will require me digging out an offensive power breakdown for Ban.

Good point. Ban would have a really hard time hurting him.

feel like Atomic Samurai is the most slept on member of S Class. Guy is stupid fast. Jagan is very necessary here. In a straight fight, Ban might be in for an extremly rough time.

This is why we need that speed breakdown!

I did the babby one from a while back so your wish is my command. ^_^

Nice! That is so crazy fast, even more than I remembered, haha.

The fact that Ban can maybe keep up with that does go to show how much faster Ban is than almost everyone else here, interestingly enough. Saitama being the upper limit of speed, thus far.

I reckon he could beat Flashy Flash without pretty reliably. Guy is just Akabane with less options.

True. Flashy Flash is the best bet for saving Jagan use.

[penguin-in-leather-jacket]

just a question ... Nik, who did the translation of the scans you posted above? if it was Tokyopop, can even a single word of text be trusted? i'm not sure i would. maybe not relevant, but there you go.

[Nik Hasta]

Just your general idea on what speed the mid-upper echleons tend to operate at and how they're tiered. I think most characters don't even have much in the way of direct speed feats, there are just a small handful of S class heroes/monsters/others that do. But the ones that do have speed feats are pretty impressive so it should be worth doing.

I'll add it to my mental list of things to go through. Might be fun. ^_^

It's mostly the issue, as with any speed breakdown, you really want solid comparative feats between everyone. Fun fact; in my mental breakdown of speed for OPM, I really wish there was an indication as to who is meant to be faster out of Genos and Zombieman because a lot of the scaling kind of hinges on that.

I think Ban is pretty up there in the GB universe in terms of single target damage. He has all that punching through diamond, making great buildings tremble with his punches and and stuff, unless I'm misremembering. I think he should be able to hurt most people here.

More to come on this pending research.

He's fast, but I think Ban probably has enough advantage in speed still that he would have a hard time doing much damage to him. And Ban's pretty evasive too, it's one of the things he consistently does. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Ban also have a ranged game?

Outside of the Jagan itself? No. He's got some weird esoteric stuff with his demon arm; punching lightning, punching wind and plasma spheres and suchlike but no beams or whatever. He's most notably a puncher of dudes.

How fast would you peg him at at the moment?

Umm... let me get back to you. I would put him somewhere in the multimach-ish area, likely higher depending on how the algorithm shakes out.

The fact that Ban can maybe keep up with that does go to show how much faster Ban is than almost everyone else here, interestingly enough. Saitama being the upper limit of speed, thus far.

True enough. Got to check my cognitive dissonances.

just a question ... Nik, who did the translation of the scans you posted above? if it was Tokyopop, can even a single word of text be trusted? i'm not sure i would. maybe not relevant, but there you go.

I'm not sure what this referring to?

The scans I've posted and that I've read through were done by a scanlation group online. Either way, to my knowledge, the Tokyopop translation mostly was a bit dodgy in terms of making Ban and Ginji a bit excessively urban/gangster-ish. I'm not aware of there being any misleading stuff in there that would change my thoughts about their capabilities.

[penguin-in-leather-jacket]

i'm not referring to anything specific; i've never read the translation by Tokyopop or any other. i just remember their actions elsewhere and felt i had to ask.

[Nik Hasta]

i'm not referring to anything specific; i've never read the translation by Tokyopop or any other. i just remember their actions elsewhere and felt i had to ask.

Alright...?